# Synodical Conference Convention Proceedings_St. Louis Missouri_1879_S7
# AI translation — CHI Digital Archive (demonstration)

— 7 —

churches of the old fatherland — this standard to them, we shall find, even where things are still best, only an Eli-discipline. Just as Eli said to his sons, "Do not do so evil," but let them go on sinning instead of removing them from office: so the German state consistories, especially when they are pressed by those individual members within their communion who still hold to doctrinal discipline and stand in statu confessionis [in a state of confession], deliver a testimony in the form of a disapproval, and think that this is enough, that they have testified against it; and they are heartily glad if the false teachers merely say some word halfway that can be given a good interpretation; but to remove such wolves from their office, they do not think of that.

At this point the question was asked whether a church body ceases to be Lutheran if at the time no doctrinal discipline is exercised. In the Formula of Concord, it was said, it is testified against the Schwenkfeldians that it does not cease to be a true Christian communion if no doctrinal discipline is exercised; there it says: "Erroneous Articles of the Schwenkfeldians: 7. That there is no true Christian congregation where no public excommunication or orderly process of the ban is held." (Epitome XII.) This was important, it was said, for the judgment about the German state churches, in which there are still individuals who testify against the prevailing laxity of their communion in doctrinal discipline and therefore believe that as long as they do so, they still have every right to call their communion a Lutheran communion. When can we say that a church communion has ceased to be Lutheran?

To this the reply was made: It is true that the thesis does not speak of when a church body ceases to be Lutheran; but we nevertheless want to make it important here that a communion loses the Lutheran character if it lets doctrinal discipline fall. For if the Lutheran Church is the one that confesses only the pure truth and nothing else, then a church body too, as soon as false doctrine may be preached in it unhindered, must at once cease to be orthodox. Also in the Papal Church individuals have testified and still testify against individual errors, as church history shows; but for that reason no Lutheran will want to maintain that the Papal Church is still an orthodox communion. The testimony of the Formula of Concord that was cited does not concern doctrinal discipline but discipline of life. — The thesis does not say: doctrinal discipline must be perfect. For in doctrinal discipline too we shall not attain perfection. But it must be in force according to the measure of the present knowledge of the truth in a church communion. And if now the church governors in the German so-called Lutheran state churches, in which everything down to the most vulgar rationalism may be taught, if these church governors themselves admit that the